Lessons that shape core values

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Lessons that shape core values

Post  highnoon on Sun 27 Nov 2011, 20:01

I was thinking this morning about what we think has happened is how we learn from experiences. When I've learned something its usually been what i thought the truth of the event was. i feel that authority teaches us how to behave but the reasons why we need to do something are not actually the reasons why they want us to do something. this could be using flouride. why we all believe its neccessary is not even in the same context of why its in the toothpaste at all. but learning how to behave happens at work and around other people. you'll be asked to go somewhere or asked not to go somewhere and certain reasons will be givin. its possible also you wont ever truely find out that the reason givin was a fake reason. but you might rationalize the reason anyway and integrate it into how you do things from now on.

one thing that happened was at a place i worked at i was called in to come to work on a day off i had. i was busy with big arrangements but was told if i didnt come to work it meant i didnt want my job. i lost my job because i didnt cancel what i was doing and goto work that shift that was never mine. i dont know how badly the person got punished for not going to his shift. all i knew is that me, a guy who was off was probably getting punished heavier for not filling in than the guy who no showed on their day of work. that struck me as odd so i never bought this line of reasoning and never ingrained into my core values that i did anything wrong. ive always justified and maintained i had the right to refuse. and that i was being blackmailed or setup. which i was.

but there are things that go over my head, because sometimes things arent so obvious. when they do happen and it looks real and consequences happen from it, you try to learn from it or analyze. but what good can come from analyzing what has occured. when what really occured isnt even what occured? ive realized there are many people out there that have taken a lot of situations at face value and created a moral code out of various life experiences. but when i hear about it. i think of many other possibilities that the other person didnt think of, and i am not sure if they are aware of it or not. i am not sure if willful ignorance is playing a part, or if they are just truely naive. i am also not sure what they think in regards to how i might perceive them if they started theorizing other possibilities. because people do not know that i am OK with talking about what ifs. they might want to but not know if i am a trusted or willing person for that matter to talk with.

But in general i feel that most people out there have created a code of values about life and how to do things or how to act and about half of it is on bogus understandings of previous life situations. and that includes me

I feel that people try to blame themselves, and then learn from it. like my job story. i couldve gone into work, but it wouldve just forced my employers hand to find another way to get rid of me. but in bending to his threat and to his will, i am shaping my core values. but i shaped them not to do that. i shaped them to be defiant in the light of such a threat. and i am careful not to be defiant just to be defiant, and in that case i felt i was right. turned out i was. but in succeeding sometimes. maybe i am just as bad as the people who dont see anything. maybe i think i see more than what i can actually see. and make the wrong choices sometimes. i am defiant and it turns out nothing was missing from the face value information and i shoot myself in the foot.

I feel that i am not really any better off than the people who do the opposite of me. i am right when others are wrong, and i am wrong when others are right. i cannot say for sure if my winnings outweigh their winnings. because i have never won their winnings before.

but i do feel that even if my winnings do outweigh theirs. i do pay the high price in being a person with a different core set of values


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Re: Lessons that shape core values

Post  KapitanScarlet on Tue 29 Nov 2011, 02:26

one thing that happened was at a place i worked at i was called in to come to work on a day off i had. i was busy with big arrangements but was told if i didnt come to work it meant i didnt want my job.
Good choice refusing to go in , sounds like a complete asshole you were working for , wouldn't waste a moment with these types of pondspawn

but i do feel that even if my winnings do outweigh theirs. i do pay the high price in being a person with a different core set of values
Yeah core values , i think are important in the welding of friendships / acquaintances, sooner or later, glimpses of these core values consciously established or unconsciously adhered to like in a religious fanatic , are displayed in ones actions and expressions with other people and I've no doubt that people subconsciously tabulate and monitor the core values of people they are dealing with constantly and make judgements on their persona from the results


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Re: Lessons that shape core values

Post  Sputnik on Thu 08 Dec 2011, 14:08

the question is: would you do it again?

how desperate can we be made to give up our Self?

Money is being made scarce, employment is being made scarcer...

This is artificial class warfare and the "new moral values" aren't all that new..

and worse of all, they seem to need at least half of us to die for "Industrialisation 2.0"

Sure, we've been given some things to play with in the meantime, Iphone, Ipad, HDTV, internet shopping, etc.

but in exchange for what? that's the other question......and you seem to have tripped over it and felt it deep inside.

Last question: red pill, blue pill or maybe no pills for you at all? maybe they fired you because you scared the shit out of them?
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Re: Lessons that shape core values

Post  highnoon on Thu 08 Dec 2011, 23:04

My vocabulary has grown over the past few days. Ive learned the word Sophist, and Specious in their meanings exactly. These two words REALLY help define the world for me. Because THAT is the energy of this world. Specious arguements or sophism.


to reword the meaning of this topic. It is those who create core values from sophisms, versus those who create core values based on the truth they see from their intuition/heart/logic.

that is why I scare people because i don't easily fall for the logic that humanity likes to use in this day and age.

My actual entire line of work this past fall has been temp jobs and about 60% of all places i goto work have sophisms working in the background. The pretext of why a Temporary labourer is even needed is fallicious usually. a 40 foot container shows up. Manager of the warehouse is lazy. tells the owner, "this is a big job tomorrow we gotta get some extra hands for this job". owner goes , ok sure, call the temporary agency get 2 guys.

They pay the temporary agency like 22 bucks an hour and 12 goes to me. theres 2 of us, so for 8 hours they pay 352 dollars for the extra hands to unload this container. the actual workers of the actual warehouse. just stand around telling us how to put the pallet together and tell us where it goes. We might even get off early cause with the bit of work they do do, it turns out to be a 6.5 hour day so i only get paid 6.5 hours, and the temp agency gets 286 dollars instead of the 352. But after we go the warehouse people can still stay there with no work to do and get their full 8 hours.


this is real world example of why the world isn't an enjoyable place. Because somebody says something plausible, somebody else believes it and approves whatever remedy corrects the concern presented, and things move forward on that pretense of "too much work tomorrow need extra people"



whats especially sad about this, is that a lower level employee, dupes the actual OWNER of a company, to pay more money than what is needed to bring in and unload shipments. its in the owners actual interest to investigate and calculate the job before approving extra money being spent on extra people. but this is not always the case. Parents believe their children, children believe their parents. Its all the same no matter the flow of authority. people are trying to cheat other people.

a sophist explanation that somebody might give to me is "well HighNoon, why are you concerned about this. A job was created for you was it not?" you got paid did you not?" this is just bribing my intellectual capacity by reminding me of the money i earned.

people are scared of me and dont like me because I am not a person to easily be bribed or satisfied with my payment. i dont find the situation or the big picture to my satisfaction in how the job was created for me. so i cannot be happy that i got paid. id only be happy if i went to ajob and the people who actually work there are side by side working with me, sweating along side with me where right from the beginning of the day i can see "wow this is a big job, no wonder they called us" and by the end of the day i feel like i actually DID help a company with my labour. but if i am doing somebody elses job while they watch me and get paid more for watching me, and the company that sponsors me gets paid more money than me. than i will just feel that on a multitude of levels multiple parties are being cheated.


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Re: Lessons that shape core values

Post  KapitanScarlet on Sun 11 Dec 2011, 11:39

Very thought inducing post Flames , and I'm quickly jotting down what came to mind from reading the first half of your post whilst i have an opportunity and before i forgot it, will read the rest , with care, later Smile

Note that the word exercise is used for both definitions of the words lesson and discipline. This is an important point. My own interpretation of the word exercise is not limited to how we think of the word in our modern times, rather exercise is an interdisciplinary approach. In other words, exercise is a philosophical medium in which the human will develops.

What I boil it all down to is this. Knowledge and the process of knowing is a process or journey that the human will is taken. The will can be taken automatically by others, or it can be taken by one's own...will. Either way, the human will is not static, or in physics terms a scalar.

And as you state "Will" developing can be guided by the self (whatever the definition of self truly is) or developing can be guided or conditioned by others , consciously known or unknown to the host
I'll give an example of how I personally attempt to own my own will. For example, my emotions have been everywhere for about a month. I was going so far off center, that I didn't even care about it, and yet still had the presence of mind to identify my errors. This ability to identify error is a key to knowledge. Not only that, but to be honest enough with oneself, to present the error to other's showing an act of humility.
"present the error to others " i think you touched on a very important underated area of communications although the timing of such a presentation and the manner of its expressed presentation is crucial in that if its done with care, its a powerful bond that both enhances the presenters presence and bond to those its presented too , if its exposed without care then the presenter will seem like a desperate confessor and be ridiculed or at best , pitied .
So the qualities of "done with care " in this case is that the presenter is able to be a master of their own error rather than a victim of it , and that can be achieved by the study of being , oneselfs and others , the humility factor is also very important on the emotional level of communications, because if the humility is missing, the presenter comes across as egotistic or other state that tends to close the nerve ends down and scramble the value of the presentation , whereas the act of humility as an emotional exchange opens up the nerve channels of others through some subconscious mystery of compassion, it is this subconscious mystery of compassion that can allow a person to suddenly change their views on another person


In the Psychopath, this subconscious mystery of compassion, is Missing or Paralyzed
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Re: Lessons that shape core values

Post  Sputnik on Mon 12 Dec 2011, 00:13

Now that I think about it I believe I inherited most of my core values directly from my parents...

They always explained to me how they came to their conclusions,

and thank goodness they always allowed me to challenge them (those conclusions)

In the end I kept the ideas which appealed to me and added my own genetic spin on the rest..

I don't think that I take 'society feedback' all that serious, for that I was always too detached from 'the borg mind' mentally.
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Re: Lessons that shape core values

Post  KapitanScarlet on Mon 12 Dec 2011, 01:35

This process of being centered and losing center is an ongoing process. It never seems to end.

This is the way that I attempt to set "core values." When I find myself in a mental box where it feels like shit is raining on my head every day, I realize that my energies are heading in the wrong directions. I have a choice. I can either destroy or create. So I have to physically put myself in a position in which to grow, be it, philosophically or physically.

A simple example of this is by describing today. Somehow I had to detach all pleasure centers of the brain and re-begin a rigid routine of: eating healthy, exercising, thinking, and creating.

In other words, I put good stuff in my mouth, channeled my physical angst into a physical exercise, and forced myself to sit down and begin a new art work. I did a very shitty job at all of these activities today, and I don't even care. The important thing is, is that I built a foundation for tomorrow, and so on.

I believe that there are DEEP DEEP factors that greatly influence one's will and one's "core values," that I'm not even ready to speculate about it just yet. But I will just throw the word "cycle" or "cycles" out there for now.

With the inevitable "loss of center" that I described in mind, I realize and understand that there are powers outside of myself that influence my "core values." These powers are both good and bad, and I choose to let neither influence me, for they exist outside of my will.

This is a knock out, drag down battle to the end.

I think that every single moment affects the will power to a degree of influence, every thing one sees hears and feels
There are also many different aspects of will power , some people can excel in the will to resist, some can excel in the will to create or destroy , some can excel in the will to be minimally influenced by outside phenomena
I can split the influences on willpower into 2 areas, the conscious and the subconscious and the instant and sustained
What distinguishes an individual in my eyes, is how they have awoken and imposed their own "sustained" conscious willpower in affecting their lifestyle and others lifestyles in a positive manner
But Sustained conscious willpower in perpetual motion requires a purpose or else it begins to fade and there does appear to be a connection between how a human is allowed to utilise their willpower and their health and joy , and that "allowed" is related to the society around them , and the "thought structure" society in their psyche
Many people are restricted in the administration of their willpower by a very influential and destructive society that exists in their psyche which they have a certain responsibility for its development and current status

If someone has an out of control habit or addiction, then that manifests as a serious limp in their ability to apply their sustained willpower in a particular direction , their inner society overrules their willpower which has the effect of dejection which can lead to the broken will which can eventually lead to suicide or other calamity

Yes there are definetly deep deep factors that affect ones will

Lada
They always explained to me how they came to their conclusions,
That was good of them, many people arent capable of that Idea

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Re: Lessons that shape core values

Post  Sputnik on Tue 13 Dec 2011, 14:52

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Re: Lessons that shape core values

Post  highnoon on Thu 16 Feb 2012, 11:32

i can tell this has been a good year for you flames.

I dont even remember what this thread is really about anymore id have to re-read my own words. but that is the secret to life i suppose what you have described. like thoughts attract like thoughts. i have my ideas on why this simplicity is not understood or exercised. for starters i suppose we all know attributes and qualities have value attached. and the more value you have the more you can market yourself. its like a interpersonal commerce type thing. i guess the problem starts when we dont put our best foot forward. we dwell on what were not proficient at and we let the feelings about that which are negative become the primary mood state that we are using for the entire day. its basically the opposite of the people who are happy and successful all the time.

we can think that the average person doesn think enough of look inward enough. but many of these so called uninspired and maybe foolishly naive people are also getting shit done. their ego and selfishness drives them forward they just strive for betterment and their lives become something. it might be hollow, maybe its not true happiness. but it has to be something. even the most vain individual that just pursues materialistic pleasures is going to have a bunch of accomplishments that they can proud of.

the ones like us who claim more awareness about the big picture. we dont realize that a degree of sweeping problems under the rug and being ignorant is good for us. wear a good mood when you wake up and forget about really whats out of our control. and priotize the day and weeks...at the end of the month you should be in a slightly better place at least than the last month. money being silly and all of these things is no excuse to not have goal and do something about it.

and what you said is exactly it. you gotta be in the right frame of mind emotionally for ANYTHING to happen.


having a smile you can turn on at any time and for it not to look forced but a vibrant confident smile is a tool. youre giving a warm impression to others. think of how deadpan many people are in the mall or public transit.

anyone who displays any type of freedom of expression is basically considered confident because its being contrasted against lifeless zombies. any person stands out like they are the top 1% if they smile in these areas.

i asked for a free bus ride and got it today but the lady bus driver said hey wait. before you get on smile and ask nicely. and i burst out smiling huge cause i felt embarassed. i had just been waiting at a stop with no money for maybe 10 minutes and just kindof asked not expecting the driver to say yes. but she had already approved me but wanted to recieve that good energy from me. like she knew i had it in me somewhere and wanted to see it perhaps. or...she saw that i was in a bum mood and was trying to cheer me up. its hard to say if it was for me, her or both us. but that "smile and say please" requirement did something for both of us in the end.

it made me think...imagine if i did everything with a smile...how many yes' would i get? how many no's have i gotten in life because i didnt put enough charm or humanity into my expression. ( i really despise charm in the sense to deceive people, but im realizing honest charm exists apart from that)

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Re: Lessons that shape core values

Post  KapitanScarlet on Fri 17 Feb 2012, 02:30

excellent constructive introspections in these 2 posts above , that is the type of self reflective dialogue I've been looking for in females

The argument from the majority of smiley happy doers is that this type of introspection is a complete waste of space as it doesn't achieve anything in their eyes , but this is because in their eyes , there is simply nothing to achieve in doing it, they just got born , found themselves as a particular type of personality that can follow and initiate the mainstream societal model of success

And they are correct to a certain degree because i anticipate that many people have varying degrees of such personal introspection but don't identify it as a work of progress so don't actually develop the skill

But my own view is that it is only because of such introspections that the human society can develop technology plus an ethical high ground for harmonious existence

These smiley doers only developed beyond the club and bone stage (in conventional evolution crap) because of introspective non-smiley tortured souls that conceived of moving to another stage of perception / development of existence

The smiley doers are important to get things done, the introspectors are required to think of all the possibilities of that doings , but i believe there are now a new breed of introspective doers which is the ideal state for me , and sometimes even an authentic smile is possible , a treat (:

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Re: Lessons that shape core values

Post  seraphim on Wed 22 Feb 2012, 06:39

I agree excellent topic and on what you put out comes back to you. When I encounter some real negative people on my job, I've done several things to see if my energy would change there own and it's amazing how the entire dynamics work and what changes happen. I have tried to find out if the person is just negative or has a very strong willpower because the can be similar. There are a few with very different energy that I stay away from. A smile always seems to calm down people who are always mad. I smile at everyone and send beam out good energy.
Sometimes it's good to shock people out of there state. So I laugh out loud a real good one in front of a person who is very negative and it works. I don't laugh at them but around them of course. I like to role play, so it works out for me.

It's all about experimenting and learning it seems as well and would like to know how yours turns out Flames. Next time when you are in a room you can practice radiating your aura and see if others notice. There is a name for it.

You said it, right frame of mind! You would be amazed Highnoon, and if you smiled at gals more often and told them very nice things, you would score. Take charge, even if you don't feel you have the willpower. Now there are better things to do in this world, but that would be an interesting experiment.
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