The "I" in your mind

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The "I" in your mind

Post  KapitanScarlet on Tue 17 Nov 2009, 22:16

What exactly "influences" and "constitutes" the "I" in the conscious mind ?
Outside stimulae through the senses from the macro world
Inside much more subtle stimulae through the micro world

In the waking world , a person can say i am i and steadily go around experiencing things as this I

In the dreaming world a person can experience things in a dream but yet not be quite capable to say i am i in that dream, but rather , they are experiencing a vessel of expression slightly displaced from their normal conscious identity , but sometimes they may have waves where they do recognize their conscious i in the dream, much like a transistor radio tuning into a weak station

In the dream, it is as if the things being expressed to them are being directed by something other than their conscious i, but now and again in that dream their conscious i can realise it is there in a dream

And some say that it is possible to become conscious in the dream world and move around in this energy dimension

But back in the waking world, its not as simple as i presumed, although people can say i am i and apparently do as they choose within reason, many of them seem to be in a form of motion not quite completely directed by their i , they are just passengers in their own beings passage of experience which is conducted by influences from their macroworld and their microworld

It is in the identification of these influences that much can be learned about the self
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Re: The "I" in your mind

Post  KapitanScarlet on Mon 23 Nov 2009, 20:48

I think it was James Hillman among others who conceptualized that "Metaphor" was a language of the unconscious .

Therefore the conscious "I" in ones mind can use metaphysical expression as a means to bring forth intelligence from its connection to the unconscious into conscious understanding and also allow other individual beings to try to construct a comparable understanding of the landscape of the unconscious

A lot of occult expressions are a good example of this .

And once someone improves a language of communication , it goes to say that they are increasing their own "influence and understanding " = "power"

It can be seen in the conscious world that certain arrangements and pronunciation of language will have a definitive effect on another listener if the speaker is aware of that listeners conditioning
Every person can be grouped into varying levels of conditioning

Therefore it is not to much of a stretch to imagine that there are also rules of language/ thoughts that go from the conscious into the unconscious and vice versa .

And then some pewople beleive that the body has its own intelligence and can be aroused into unity with ones "I" consciousness
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The Numen

Post  KapitanScarlet on Mon 23 Nov 2009, 22:04

The Numen

"The term numinous, based on the Latin numen ("will, the active power of the divine") was coined by Rudolf Otto (1917/1926) to define a "category for the interpretation and evaluation" of nonrational manifestations of the sacred. According to Otto, the numinous is characterized by a "sense of one's creature state"

The numen, according to Jung, is that which offers the real healing.
The numen arises out of the flesh as a direct result of the very nature of matter itself. In other words, there is no split between spirit and matter. Every natural system has an inner life, a conscious center, from which action is directed. The body, the materia of the flesh, is one of these natural systems.
The collective unconscious contains not only the residues of human evolution but also the residues of animal evolution. Coming to terms with the unconscious – that is, becoming conscious – requires, therefore, a coming to terms with one’s instinctual, animal nature. Given that one’s instinctual nature is directly related to the body, one can propose that a new relation to one’s body must be established for a more complete individuation.

Though Jung was deeply concerned with the question of instincts, the body itself was and continues to be largely marginalized in psychoanalytic practice. Wilhelm Reich, colleague of Freud and Jung at the turn of the last century, was the only real proponent of somatic inquiry, of working directly with, on and through the body. Unfortunately, he was rarely taken seriously. He was often mocked and sorely excluded from the formulation of psychodynamic understanding within the context of analysis and the unconscious. It is to Reich that many of the body-oriented approaches to the psyche owe their debt of existence, including Reichian therapy and bio-energetics. From the perspective of analytical psychology, this important work still remains in the shadows.

Considering the negative, pathological effects generated by the relative split of body and mind, it feels important if not imperative to offer skillful ways and means of affirming the irrevocable and harmonizing relationship between the instinctual, animal body and the archetypal, spiritual impulses of mind. To begin this task requires a brief discussion on the nature of numen and matter. This is followed by contributions from participants involved in the somatic work .

Numen

In his letter dated August 20, 1949, Jung says it is the numen which offers "the real therapy, and inasmuch as you attain to the numinous experiences you are released from the curse of pathology." (Jung, 1973, 8/20/49)

Jung refers to the numen as "a dynamic agency or effect not caused by an arbitrary act of will. On the contrary, it seizes and controls the human subject….The numinosum - whatever its cause may be - is an experience of the subject independent of his will.…The numinosum is the influence of an invisible presence that causes a peculiar alteration of consciousness." (Jung, 1989, Par. 6)

In addition to the qualities listed above, the experience of the numen carries with it a fateful sense of meaning. It is not just a random or superficial experience but, as with the phenomenon of synchronicity, there is an understanding that the experience carries particular and personal meaning. One gains insight, often profound insight. Most frequently, insight and numen are one. Both are accompanied by experiences of surprise, shock, wonder, awe; both leave us feeling different in our skin.

Perhaps the visitation of the numen is most often understood as a descent of the Spirit to humankind, a transpersonal visitation from “above” that floods the body and mind with its presence. "

There was also the theory of the duende , a phenomena that is invoked through dance , specifically flamenco , which seems to have relation to numinous

And this comment is interesting on a japanese aspect of the duende


Butoh

Butoh, also known as Dance of Darkness, is a Japanese dance form that emerged out of post-war Japan which includes the experience of nuclear holocaust. Although its roots can be found in the oldest Japanese folkloric traditions, Butoh recognizes influences from post-war European movements, most predominantly, German Expressionism. Although one can make attempts to describe Butoh according to these categories, conclusive classification is not possible. Butoh arises outside convention, outside form, outside any prescribed approach. It is, at its most authentic, a protest against those very elements.

Butoh has been viewed by some as a search for a new identity, a way of establishing meaning for a society that had unmercifully experienced a profound breach in their personal, cultural and existential reality. It is considered by its practitioners to be an exploration into the unconscious, into the realm of imagination and shadows. Movement in this art form does not focus on depiction, nor is it choreographed in the usual way, i.e., shaping movement from the conscious level. Movement intentionally begins and continues from the inner recesses of the psyche. The focus is on tracking the immediate metamorphosis of psyche through movement. The discipline in tracking the psyche in this way can then, when desired, be ritualized or formalized into performance.

In Butoh, the intention is to follow, through movement, an internal psychic image to the conclusion of becoming the consciousness of the image itself. You are no longer moving like a river, for example, you become, as closely as possible, the consciousness of river. This approach encourages an experience of the primal energies which animate and nourish the very core of our being and engages the instinctual level of soul.

One well-known Butoh performer, Min Tanaka, traveled the entire length of Japan, dancing each day. His idea was to feel the difference in the ground at different places. He called the experiment Hyperdance. He said that the dance is not in the place, rather the dance is the place. "The Butoh dancer tries to capture subtleties of the soul, understanding that dance is the movement of the soul…accompanied by the body. The soul is not there for others to like it. It is there to express what it has to express…The only requisite [for Butoh] is to not lose faith or hope; to pursue dreams and grab them strongly in the body, like a beautiful treasure that keeps us alive. Once there, it begins to wake up and move the world of emotions and feelings."

I also see from this concept, that to engage this numen in the sexual realm, could be categorised as arousing the "signature" of eros to flow through one .. so to speak
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Re: The "I" in your mind

Post  tgII on Tue 24 Nov 2009, 11:14

Kapis, have you read the theory of Julian Jaynes in his incredible
insights on the ego and "I?"

It is contained in his book The Origin of Consciousness and the
Break down of the Bicameral Mind
.


  • Julian Jaynes Society:
    http://www.julianjaynes.org/


Both MSTAR and I have concurred this is an important work in
trying to come to any understanding of consciousness. After reading
this book it completely changed my outlook on my existence which is
how I stumbled across MTSAR's work way back when he had his
blog up.
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Re: The "I" in your mind

Post  KapitanScarlet on Tue 24 Nov 2009, 11:18

i have not, but will have a check tonight on that site .. ta
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Re: The "I" in your mind

Post  KapitanScarlet on Wed 25 Nov 2009, 00:07

From that website link, i pulled out his 4 main hypotheses
1. consciousness based on language,
2. dating the emergence of consciousness,
3. a previous mental model based on auditory hallucinations called the bicameral mind, and
4. the neurological model for the bicameral mind.

And this link o that site compares some evidence
http://www.julianjaynes.org/evidence_summary.php

Regarding the interpretation of the ego and the i consciousness in current times, is there a summary of how jaynes interprets that

Decided to drop the terms ego and id for my own short definition of the i , as they are someones elses terms and everyone seems to have varying ideas of what they actually mean

I view the i awareness as the conscious thinker which can contemplate its own reflection
Then i see the I awareness with the following 3 attachments / extensions of its I-ness

It has an interactive persona which relates with other physical beings in the outer realm
It has an interactive imagarena which contemplates inside its psyche and also interacts with what i would term x factors
It also has a body intelligence which provide further impressions to its psyche

The purpose for the I is to first become aware of its own “acute” existance (awakening) , then to evolve its own power over its impressions and expressions
In essence, it is the interface between the imagerena and the physical world with the power for destruction or creation .
Then from a position of evolved pure I, to investigate its spiritual purpose

The undeveloped or arrested I is a passenger in its own expressions and impressions and can be hijacked by devious, flirtive or creative energys which gain access to the physical plain through its docility or ignorance

The pure I can perceive and observe the change in its own residue during physical world interactions with other beings and so it can begin to learn about its interactive persona and how it affects other beings whom are in contact with it , but just as important , how other beings or thoughts on them, affect its own interactive persona which is capable of taking up a life of its own so to speak .
The pure I can also monitor its own impressions and expressions then reflect their purpose in an ethical interpretation and make adjustments in line with the ethical ideal
The pure I also develops a relationship with its body intelligence which is separate but connected to its psyche

The I is the centre of consciousness , listening to its body in its role as a gatekeeper between the psychic and physical realm
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Re: The "I" in your mind

Post  seraphim on Sat 28 Nov 2009, 22:17

For sure will read this thread when I can, thanks folks.
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Re: The "I" in your mind

Post  Sputnik on Thu 03 Dec 2009, 16:59

Don't say that I will depart tomorrow --
even today I am still arriving.

Look deeply: every second I am arriving
to be a bud on a Spring branch,
to be a tiny bird, with still-fragile wings,
learning to sing in my new nest,
to be a caterpillar in the heart of a flower,
to be a jewel hiding itself in a stone.

I still arrive, in order to laugh and to cry,
to fear and to hope.

The rhythm of my heart is the birth and death
of all that is alive.

I am the mayfly metamorphosing
on the surface of the river.
And I am the bird
that swoops down to swallow the mayfly.

I am the frog swimming happily
in the clear water of a pond.
And I am the grass-snake
that silently feeds itself on the frog.

I am the child in Uganda, all skin and bones,
my legs as thin as bamboo sticks.
And I am the arms merchant,
selling deadly weapons to Uganda.

I am the twelve-year-old girl,
refugee on a small boat,
who throws herself into the ocean
after being raped by a sea pirate.
And I am the pirate,
my heart not yet capable
of seeing and loving.

I am a member of the politburo,
with plenty of power in my hands.
And I am the man who has to pay
his "debt of blood" to my people
dying slowly in a forced-labor camp.

My joy is like Spring, so warm
it makes flowers bloom all over the Earth.
My pain is like a river of tears,
so vast it fills the four oceans.

Please call me by my true names,
so I can hear all my cries and my laughter at once,
so I can see that my joy and pain are one.

Please call me by my true names,
so I can wake up,
and so the door of my heart
can be left open,
the door of compassion.

~Thich Nhat Hanh


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Re: The "I" in your mind

Post  KapitanScarlet on Sat 05 Dec 2009, 15:14

More Scorpio than Gemini it seems

Don't say that I will depart tomorrow --
even today I am still arriving.

You should say "We" instead of "I"
But i have located your symbolic life sign and the gauge is still dropping, this i can say for sure




Footnote - And your photoshop manipulation of the Perfectly colour balanced header is an absolute "Glaring" disaster
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Re: The "I" in your mind

Post  seraphim on Sun 06 Dec 2009, 09:35

From research on the caves by Pino Turolla I found this very interesting character who talks of the consciousness and who happened to be a student of Turollas. I always felt it was much more than what it is. One always wants to know and be safe in that knowing, but what do we really know....

He has different talks so feel free to choose which one you like, more on youtube.
Peter Brown
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ROL02fBGIU4&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLd-PFshoX0&NR=1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dbPXP5sKzw0

http://www.theopendoorway.org/peterbrown.html

When I get a chance, I will get back to the original topic later, and maybe tie it all in, where to even start......were you being picky Kapis, gosh!!
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Re: The "I" in your mind

Post  seraphim on Wed 09 Dec 2009, 23:40

A unified field of consciousness....? There could be some brilliance in the madness with Peter Brown.
He recommends Austin Osman Spare. I'm going to print this out and read it more thoroughly.
http://www.rosenoire.org/archives/Spare,_Austin_Osman_-_The_Book_of_Pleasure.pdf
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Re: The "I" in your mind

Post  tgII on Thu 10 Dec 2009, 01:29

    A unified field of consciousness....? There could be some brilliance in the madness with Peter Brown.


A word of caution, not that it might be the particular case here,
but if you have listened to everything Joseph Farrell has discussed
in all of his interviews, and if you have read all of his books, like I
have, pardon me... Embarassed ...then you would know there are people
using his theories as springboards to launch their own notoriety in
order to gather their own little flock of sheep
.


Be very careful what you are reading and how you use that new
knowledge.



    "There is a room where the light won't find you; if you do
    not have direct personal experience don't fucking dabble
    with demons."
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Re: The "I" in your mind

Post  seraphim on Thu 10 Dec 2009, 02:33

The thing is it's the demons who try to dabble with everyone. I don't dabble with demons, I study them.

I get that the establishment wants us to become One. They all want us to have the same state of mind. In 2012 it will be enlightened happy Buddhas obeying them or else one dies. I understand the "We" concept very well. The picture does all the explaining.

But what this man, whether on drugs or a puppet, did explain about an experience he had, which is universal and occurs when one goes into the higher states, and that is your mind becomes all minds, it is like having the mind of a god, a unified field of conscious, samadhi it goes under many names. No more good, bad, dualities, no more labeling, nothing.
And this is not something I read about, this is what happens. I am grateful for all your book recommendations.

But I'm always thinking what these experiences are, and would never take them for granted or believe I am in heaven or the end goal or an enlightened being and blah blah. I would like to remain an individual soul, stay centered and balanced, no matter what I experience, and stay on the path of freedom. This man Peter Brown is caught in the experience, and he does need to snap out of it, staying in that mind frame will not free him.

So after all that, I would like to know if this unified mind experience is that of Evil's or is it something greater, like the Source.

Now if this unified field is just experiencing what "Evils" mind is.......now that would be an amazing feat of "Evils".
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Re: The "I" in your mind

Post  KapitanScarlet on Thu 10 Dec 2009, 22:58

Some interesting thoughts on that rosenoire link , will have to scan through that one soon , pity it is not worded in more simple speak

THE CONSUMER OF RELIGION
Kia, in its Transcendental and Conceivable Manifestation.
Of name it has no name, to designate. I call it Kia I dare not claim
it as myself. The Kia which can be expressed by conceivable ideas, is
not the eternal Kia, which burns up all belief but is the archetype of
"self," the slavery of mortality. Endeavouring to describe "it," I
write what may be but not usually-called the "book of lies"*(1). The
unorthodox of the originable-a volant "sight," that conveys somehow by
the incidental, that truth is somewhere. The Kia which can be vaguely
expressed in words is the "Neither-Neither," the unmodified "I" in the
sensation of omnipresence, the illumination symbolically transcribed
in the sacred alphabet, and of which I am about to write. Its
emanation is its own intensity, but not necessariness, it has and ever
will exist, the virgin quantum-by its exuberance we have gained
existence. Who dare say where, why and how it is related? By the
labour of time the doubter inhabits his limit. Not related to, but
permitting all things, it eludes conception, yet is the quintessence
of conception as permeating pleasure in meaning. Anterior to Heaven
and Earth, in its aspect that transcends these, but not intelligence,
it may be regarded as the primordial sexual principle, the idea of
pleasure in self-love. Only he who has attained the death posture can
apprehend this new sexuality, and its almighty love satisfied. He that
is ever servile to belief, clogged by desire, is identified with such
and can see but its infinite ramifications in dissatisfaction*(2). The
progenitor of itself and all things, but resembling nothing, this
sexuality in its early simplicity, embodies the everlasting. Time has
not changed it, hence I call it new. This ancestral sex principle, and
the idea of self, are one and the same, this sameness its exaction and
infinite possibilities, the early duality, the mystery of mysteries,
the Sphinx at the gates of all spirituality. All conceivable ideas
begin and end as light in its emotion, the ecstasy which the creation
of the idea of self induces. The idea is unity by the formula of self,
its necessary reality as continuity, the question of all things, all
this universe visible and invisible has come out of it. As unity
conceived duality, it begot trinity, begot tetragrammaton. Duality
being unity, is time, the complex of conception, the eternal
refluctuation to the primeval reality in freedom-being trinity of
dualities, is the six senses, the five facets of sex-projecting as
environment for self-assimilation in denial, as a complete sexuality.
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Re: The "I" in your mind

Post  seraphim on Fri 11 Dec 2009, 08:54

Yeah have got to read that too...

Wanted to add from my previous post.

People have so much potential and their hearts can be their best guides if they were aware, so it’s so difficult to rationalize how it has gotten so bad out there, only if people can just take over there own lives. No matter how strong one is I guess it’s hard not to be affected by this 'mass mind entity' out there. I know that I was caught.

Demons are like a parasite and people don’t even know they are there or how much they have become a part of there lives.

The priest said if I meditate the devil will not like that and I will go tell hell. Funny huh.
Or did the priest really care and mean I will be more suspectable to demons and wanted me to use caution. I don't think so!
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Re: The "I" in your mind

Post  KapitanScarlet on Sat 24 Apr 2010, 13:35

Concsiousness
It was mentioned before the distinction between awake consciousness and sleep consciousness with the distinction being that someone in awake consciousness can say i am i and perceive their own existence as it happens in every waking moment
The other distinction was whilst that waking consciousness was in a dream, and its ability to declare " i am i " in the dream has been mysteriously de-activated .
The person has a form of more vague consciousness of what is occuring in the dream , a dream existence, but they cannot immediately connect this dream consciousness with their waking i consciousness as if their dream existence is being projected to their consciousness only , bypassing their ability to perceive these projections through the filter of their i consciousness

But it is also proven that some people can indeed be completly lucid in their dreams and even direct their dreams, proving that the "i consciousness" can perceive in dream existence thus proving that there is indeed a connection between awake existence and dream existence

therefore the distinction in consciousness is not truly defined in the awake or dream existences because you can have i-consciousness in both realms , and you can also lack i-consciousness in both realms .

The distinction in consciousness is actually defined in consciousness itself
The distinctions are consciousness itself which is the ability to perceive phenomena and act / react to that phenomena
And there is also Self -Consciousness which is the i-consciousness

Every living person has consciousness , but the degree to which they have self-consciousness differs dramatically
How a person has evolved their self consciousness is directly related to how they perceive and value other consciousnesses

A language of meaning is required to try and define the critical difference between consciousness and self-consciousness

And the key words in that defining language is "intentionality" and "Intention"

Intentionality is an excellent term introduced by Jeremy Bentham and my personal use of this term is that intentionality represents all the random or occuring impulses and instincts that occur in every human consciousness
BUt it is how one reacts or directs these impulses or instincts that declares ones intention which is directly related to the evolution of ones self-consciousness which is the i-consciousness

Evolution of I-consciousness is defined by the manifestation and realisation of ones intention , which is not necessarily good or evil , as those judgements are defined with how peoples intentionality or intention integrate with each other

So it seems that to be a good progressive person in a society , as in adhere the self to a code of ethics beneficial to the self and to other selfs , another form of consciousness must be developed which could be termed others-consciousness

A person begins with consciousness, in which state they can be very eratic and unpredictable
They evolve self-consciousness in which they begin to express certain distinct intentions which defines their persona
Which evolves their others-consciousness where they have self- intentions but become aware of how the manifestation and realisation of these self-intentions may affect others as far as they are able to perceive from the phenomena available to them
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Re: The "I" in your mind

Post  KapitanScarlet on Sat 23 Oct 2010, 12:16

So back to the the Ego since its a term that has been completly overused in society but without distinct understanding of its meaning which for me it is an influence of impression and expression that is an aspect of the human i consciousness
Both a positive or negative aspect depending on if the particular Human i has evolved knowledge of disciplining the ego so that its influence is limited to a beneficial influence in the ethical landscape
If not disciplined, the ego-influence can lead to pure evil actions by subconscious delegation
But it could also be supposed that if a person beleives in a supreme being or God , then the discipline or lack of discipline of the ego influence also may increase or reduce the relationship with that supreme intelligence which results in that person having a lesser conscious awareness which is directly related to the perception of harmony and the perception of angst
The ego influence relates closely with TEmptation

I will look out for any public illustrations of the egos impressions / expressions to further my own point

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_l5ETBRqFU
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Re: The "I" in your mind

Post  highnoon on Sat 23 Oct 2010, 17:51

i think the ego is a dissonance tool. the ideal self and the self that is present. if a person can handle pain, they wont follow the temptations that is maybe an action within a social opportunity, if they need to bring their self closer to the ego self, then they'll take those actions. morality is like a way of negotiating with these black and white desires. i believe that those who manage their ego to some degree have an ego that is based around balancing it. there might be one general course of action that leads to a benefit, however by taking it you upset oneself for taking it, therefore you cant enjoy doing it, and therefore you dont do it and miss that benefit, however gain or maintain your psychological expectation of yourself. you would actually cause dissonance within yourself for doing what others might do easily and eagerly, whereas if those people didnt do it, they would regret passing up an opportunity. both camps act within their own definations of their egos, their egos just desire different ways of making it happy. therefore the ego is a blueprint to build on in order to be proud of yourself and nobody can really escape from it.
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Re: The "I" in your mind

Post  Sputnik on Sun 24 Oct 2010, 16:08

Religion is what peope do to avoid hell, spirituality is what people do once their been there.
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Re: The "I" in your mind

Post  KapitanScarlet on Mon 25 Oct 2010, 02:41

The affairs of the ego – a fairytale

There is the individual consciousness that declares I am I , this is called the I consciousness
This I consciousness then has inputs to its consciousness termed impressions and outputs from its consciousness termed expressions
These impressions consist of feelings and thoughts
These expressions are the physical expression of an impressed feeling or impressed thought .
Some could argue that to contemplate to oneself is to express thoughts to oneself , but I will limit expressions to the entry into the physical world and impressions are what occurs in the psychic realm
So an expression is whatever is released out into physical reality and an impression is what is going on in the psychic realm , or coming back into the psychic realm from physical reality.
To make things slightly more complex, this i-consciousness is also existing as a form of gatekeeper between 2 different dimensions
These dimensions are physical reality and the psychic realm of thoughts and feelings
Some will say that a feeling is physical , and this can be true, but the feeling always produces a psychic impression
Physical reality is governed by space and time
Psychic realm is governed by something undefined

Now in the state of dreaming, it has been proven that it is possible to become lucid , and therefore I have to presume that when a person goes to sleep , they initially are stepping completely into the psychic realm , so from a gatekeeper with partial consciousness in both worlds, they now are existing only in the psychic realm with reference to their consciousness as they enter sleep mode.
To strengthen this possibility , I point out that in the awake mode of consciousness when a person is absolutely engaged in some pursuit , their i-consciousness steps completely into the physical reality and has no present conscious impressions from the psychic realm . This is not to say that the communication between the psychic realm and the engaged physical activity is broken, it just becomes sub-conscious , maybe like the so called zen moment of expression.

So this I consciousness which is a gatekeeper between the 2 dimensions of the psychic world and physical world, can in certain moments of awake time step totally into the physical world and does in sleep time step totally into the psychic realm

For most people , as they “fall” asleep , their I consciousness seems to switch off , and then they are open to a whole new world of impressions , some they remember when they are next awake , most they do not, lucidity can for some occur at random , some never experience it, but some say they can master it , for those masters , it could be said that they “rise” to sleep , but this is a separate subject in itself it seems.

And for most people during awake time, they have varying proportions of consciousness in both the physical world and in the psychic world .

In school, they learn how to navigate and understand the physical world
Nobody teaches them how to navigate and understand the psychic realm
But there are many studies available to illuminate the psychic realm , for example , the divination arts etc

Now when a person is in the womb , they are still existing in the psychic realm , but being prepared for the physical realm by the physicality of the mother.
As the baby is expressed into the physical world, there still remains a direct connection from its mother via the umbilical chord . I believe there is something critical about this umbilical chord and how it is dealt with by the birthers , but this is yet to be expressed .

Once this umbilical chord is cut and the baby slapped a bit to get it crying (expressing) there then is a period of time whereby the baby is still existing mainly in the psychic realm but slowly gaining consciousness in the physical realm . The baby is very aware although helpless , but it simply has not developed its i-consciousness in relation to the physical reality .
It is given a name , given some traits etc and ever so slowly its i-consciousness develops or becomes aware of itself , of its name , and its traits as labelled by others, and it becomes self conscious which is the essence of the i-consciousness

As it becomes aware of itself , it also becomes sub-conscious of 2 other presences, that is its conscience and this ego
The conscience is its psychic guide, the ego is its physical reality trainer
Initially its conscience transmits to it subconsciously that there is a God or something of higher power watching and judging its activity in this physical reality so to move with care .
Initially the ego slowly instills the need to compete and compare with others into it, the need to find its individuality and unique expression and stand above others, to seek acclaim from its elders and aquaintances
Everything is going fine, the conscience is looking after and guiding activity in the psychic realm and the ego is doing a great job developing its skills in the physical world
The proportion of conscience and ego influence varies with each person

But then , a third party enters the game , Eros is its name , and it manifests itself through the act of puberty
This is a major shift in perspectives, all of a sudden , the physical reality becomes more immediate , a new form of competition develops, life is no longer a game, now it becomes serious , feelings start to take on a life or death umbrella , they seem to eclipse thoughts like a new invasion of imminence
But the ego has the answers
The ego begins to develop a great rappore with the i-consciousness , it has energy it has ambition , the conscience is silent and deep in the psychic realm always emanating but seeming more distant

The ego is in control , leading the i-consciousness in its ambition for progression in the physical reality , to aquire , to perform , to seek the acclaim of others , to show how special you are .
The ego is fair , the ego is square , as long as things go the way it wants them too .

The conscience is still there communicating that the i-consciousness must look at the bigger picture of how it affects others and to consider what it is doing at all times.

But the egos seduction techniques are much stronger as it builds ones personality into a shining beacon of strength , based on being better than others , not only being better, but winning, winning was the sign of conquest, of acclaims to come, of attention , of worship, of respect
I am the best , better than all the rest, and so it seemed a simple ballgame, the rules and regulations were identified, be better than the other people at working and playing and you get the top rewards , then your ego gets carressed through attentions and affections and praises for your clarified competitive or performed actions.

So this ego influences the i-consciousness through impressions to make it perform particular expressions in the physical reality that lead to acclaim
But this ego activity is very very seductive to the i-consciousness and pretty soon, it has broken of contact with its conscience which has been replaced by more ego impressions , much more to be achieved

But then one night , whilst sleeping , the i-consciousness becomes lucid and is confronted by the impression of Eros
Eros whispers into its ear, I am the lord of ectasy , I am darkness , I am the light , I am the revelation of wisdom , your conscience will guide you, your ego will show you , but I will deny you, for no one comes to me , only I to them , I tell you this my friend , for when I come to you , you will remember me , you may worship me and yeah you may aghast me . I come from your past to alter your future invading this present , but I come to every one and I offer each the wisdom, the fruits, the extasy to what their appetite be developed
But I tell you this , you may refuse me , you may accept me, but no one may abuse me, for my wrath will render thee blind , yeah will render thee blind , so be ready for me, you will feel me , for I am in truth part in you , yes I am the unlimited psychic weaver for you , just as the ego is your limited physical weaver

And how will you render me blind eros …..inquires the i-consciousness
by slaying your ego my friend replies eros , by slaying your ego , but in that slaying , you may see the dark and you may see the light my friend , that is my gift of wisdom , yeah that is my gift of wisdom , and in that moment your ego is dying , you will fall my friend , you will fall, and cry out to your conscience , your conscience will reply, but it will request an explanation from your ego , your ego will have the option to admit its intrusions into my psychic realm and all will begin to regain balance once more, the ego will be resurrected as the super-ego that is my fruit my friend that is my fruit .
The fruit is the union of the ego and the conscience , the super-ego which aquires my wisdom
But if your ego denies its limit, you will continue to fall my friend continue to fall and then you will look to others egos for guidance , and you will not hear from me again my friend , for you are lost

And what of your extasy Eros ? Inquires the i-consciousness
That comes later , when you are ready my friend , when you are ready , and you will know when you are ready , because now you have wisdom and now you have fruit, and through my wisdom with my fruit may you feel my extasy
This is my mystery my friend , and that is my promise
Awaken now with me
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Re: The "I" in your mind

Post  Sputnik on Mon 25 Oct 2010, 10:31





He's got it mostly right. He said those three selfs are not seperate things....

Consciousness is not an "aspect we have", we "are a form of consciousness".

I say they are not things (as he puts it) at all, they are spirits (independent spirits in different realms).

The Kahunas look at them as autonomous entities.

Ku = Unihipili (animal spirit), Lono = Uhane (I conciousness) and Kane is Aumakua (guardian spirit).

"Huna" is a white man's concept and not to be mistaken with Kahuna Shamanic knowledge, Huna apostles only borrowed from them.

The key is not to mush them together and think you are what you are not

...but to learn to communicate with your lower and higher evolved SPIRIT relatives...

He also mistakes Ku to be the body. Ku is the animal spirit who is caretaker of the physical body.

The human form has 4 different bodies in total.

It is also NOT true that the Aumakua (Kane) was depicted "normally" as a uncut stone,

Hawaiian Kahuna's carved the Higher evolved spirit relative as an ancestor spirit.

Sergej Kalihi (video) is confusing a lot of things, he is hanai (adopted).

He makes a great western psychologist but he is definetely NOT a Kahuna.

Hawaiian Tiki's


Tahitian Tiki Totem - the three spirits stacked on top of each other
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Re: The "I" in your mind

Post  KapitanScarlet on Mon 25 Oct 2010, 23:11

Interesting theories, I have noted down some brief highlights

Headress represents thought in wood carvings , headress to the ground signifies physical experience , memory thinking
So the Ku is the subconscious ...memory function , senses etc and you can work with the Ku
If your holding tension then this affects your ability to function with it
The Ku determines reality and is influenced more by powerful sensory inputs , as it learns better from those

The Lono is the conscious , headress goes high to represent the imagination thinking process
It makes “Decisions”

The uncut Stone represents Kane the higher self , functions creativity , inspiration , creates events in your life from universal energy
The Ku can obstruct this higher self expression with its fears and the Lono can obstruct this higher self expression with its decisions
Then there is a companion to the higher self representing the unified being = total absolute confidence , integrated
Wonder if modern grave stones were derived from the stone Kane representation ?

He says “What are the various aspects of ourself that we have”
so according to him , these 3 aspects are different functions of one self

But you Irony are suggesting that the i-consciousness must learn to communicate with 2 different spirits , which reside with your consciousness the animal spirit and the guardian spirit , not exactly aspects, more separate entitys ? Or are these just figures of speech that meet the same objectives

And So is the Ku in the khabs or is the khabs in the ku ?

And 4th question, according to Aristotle, Science is where Mankind has developed the concept of Certainty.
Therefore it follows that the function that led to science being developed is the master of certainty.
The master consciousness function that constructed the certaintys of science is "Intuition"
Where does intuition operate in your 3 or 4 spirits connection ?
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Re: The "I" in your mind

Post  Sputnik on Tue 26 Oct 2010, 04:38

Yes. They (and we) are autonomous. Just as water is not fire and wind is not earth.

Though we (and them) thrive by cooperating with each other.



Kane was not depicted as a "uncut stone". I don't know where he got that from.

I prefer to speak of the Aumakuas or ancestor spirits.

If the stars are in the soul or the soul is in the stars? Good question, I wouldn't think to know for sure.

The only thing I am pretty sure of is that there are no "oneway-roads" in our existence.

Intuition is what we get when we communicate with the Unihipili (animal spirit),

prophetic insight is what we get when we communicate with the Aumakua (ancestor/guardian spirit).

Our job ("the speaking gods") is to comprehend and learn from experience.

That's why ego stands for I in latin.
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Re: The "I" in your mind

Post  KapitanScarlet on Sun 07 Nov 2010, 03:08

So regarding the dna structure, how does the hawain theory of being tie in with dna , in their undserstandings , if they have considered such, does dna just contain elements of ku as ku is the memory elemental
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Re: The "I" in your mind

Post  Sputnik on Sun 07 Nov 2010, 13:15

DNA is the pivot between spirit and body. It is through your DNA that you can communicate with your ancestory, but it is not the "BODYCELLS"...the atoms or their chemistry..that keeps your DNA molecules together..

I am still confused about this one incidence I had when I learned a Tai Qi move sequence and I couldn't differenciate between a spirit entity giving me a "free lecture" by a form of posession, or if I had tapped into my own past life memories...because I was so emmerged into the moment and exercise (completely foreign to me from a rational point of view but performing it PERFECTLY) that I was too busy to pay attention from were that information came from. I tend to think that in this case it was indeed a (deceased human) spirit teacher.

Another example is that I could do thinks at the age of 10 that I didn't learn, but one would NEED! to learn before being able to do them. What I am saying is that the unihipili (Ku) has access to your pastlife memories beyond the current life through the DNA.

To a point were you can SEE the past through images in your mind telling you the core story, were you can reckognize if you have met somebody before (past life) and what your old issues are...sounds like the "Celestine Prophesy" doesn't it, but that's properbly because the author went to Peru which may have triggered something inside of him to write it all down as he expereinced it.

I have had those notions since early childhood, so I can say I am safe from having been tweaked into "believing"..but I did like reading the Celestine Prophesy (first book) a lot.

There have been a few places in my travels were I felt a mystical smile on my face and a corresponddance of my bones with the local soils.

Do a mental exercise, imagine all the people who lived before you were born and whose DNA is now yours. This is your ancestral familytree and you can talk to all of them, you can know what they knew because it is the record of life itself, that's what a Shaman usually does. You can go as far as to see them through your own face, but you got to be strong. Some of the lifestories are heavy tobac. Only a totally honest human can handle such a experience well or would even go that far. The Shaman's job is to help you get in touch with it.

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